Apoorva Mandavilli, reporter for the New York Times, talks with Rachel Maddow about what herd immunity means and what the future of Covid-19 in the United States is likely to be as a "manageable threat" if herd immunity is not achieved.
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“Did Trump get the vaccine?”
-Yes, he did.
Chance of Herd Immunity: 95%
“On live TV?”
No, in private.
Chance of Herd Immunity: 5%.
and he’s so much a pathetic loser with no heart that he don’t give a s__t about what’s happening to the country, and not a single tear for any who died in this mess. He knew he would be in deep trouble if he didn’t get another 4 years. Now it’s payback time
While getting vaccinated is going to reduce the number of deaths by a massive percentage, ie high nineties……. This idea, that there’s such a thing as herd immunity, where the Coronavirus/COVID-19 is concerned, is just a tory pipe-dream, from the start of last year…….. And that’s simply because, the coronavirus/COVID-19 is a part of the flu family of viruses 🦠, and as such, it’s highly unlikely, for there to ever be herd immunity for humans, to this virus 🦠, which is shown by the fact, that we have to have the flu jab every year……… So this means, that we will almost definitely(unless there’s a true medical breakthrough) have to have a Covid jab with the flu jab every year too………. This has been shown, to be understood in the UK already, by the fact that the British government, has already ordered enough of the vaccine, to give everyone a third jab, as a booster……. Which they have admitted, but they are not making a big thing about it, because they don’t want people to act stupidly, just because they are likely to be having the jab yearly………
@Norrin Radd, there are many variants of flu. Not only that, but flu mutates. The same flu shot is not produced every year. The flu vaccine is a best guess of the flu types expected.
@Golden Shine you’re exactly right about what you just wrote. Not everyone’s know that about the flu shot each year. Anyway coronavirus is not new. Many are with us since many years, and sometimes a simple little cold is a coronavirus. Only that this one is really hard and tricky for many people. Thanks to the new vaccine technology, arrived just in time
No he didn’t that was Biden. President Trump told everyone that Ivermectin and HDC worked . But the democratic didn’t want that . So he rolled this injection out at warp speed so that they couldn’t make us take it. It is an experimental injection stated by the FDA. Read the hand out. On top of that read everything in it. 5 out of 7 Bill Gates who openly state we need population reduction has his hands in it. Trump make it an experimental injection gave us the choice versus them forcing us to take it.
If they fall short of herd immunity and more people get infected, they can only blame themselves for being stupid. Welcome to crazy America.
You do realize the majority of people in the world do not live in the United States.
I think many of those that won’t get the vaccine are just afraid of needles.
@Golden Shine maybe. A needle that is nothing for second, compare to a few weeks in hospital, and if not lucky, a ventilator insertion. Me I made an intelligent choice and had my shot, and no pain and no side effects since. Come on people, don’t be chicken lol
THANKS !!! I HOPE NOT FALL IN STUPIDITY LINE 😉
Stay inside forever
Then there will be a catastrophe as there is in India. 😢
You may well be right, but it is likely that this catastrophe will be for the vaccination resistant sub-group. A deadlier version of Covid may develop as it still has millions of hosts it can mutate in but it is very likely that only those without immunity will be effected. I wouldn’t be surprised if there are sudden outbreaks in specific areas wherein even the young and healthy get very ill and die; and all because Covid was allowed to find so many new hosts, the majority of which had no idea they were concocting inside their own bodies a new and deadly version that they then released with every exhaled breath [and did so for days and days].
@david bellamy wow, an accomplished virologist on youtube mixing it up with the commoners. Isn’t it illegal to experiment on human beings? That’s whats going on here with this ”covid vaccination” crap
I’m surprised some of you are willing to cross the street. Nothing but misplaced fear.
@Sue Howie unless the wild virus mutates to the point where the current vaccines are no longer effective.
No.. with 1/2 of America vaccinated, the virus can NOT spread crazy fast like in India. We will just have a level of constant death .. like with the seasonal Flu.. that everyone ignores and accepts as normal. Except most of the people dying will be Republicans, go figure!!
What happens is that we better pray that this virus doesn’t mutate into a vaccine resistant strain before we find a cure. That would be a nightmare.
Preyers
@Jon Nelson Heck, in 1918 nobody even knew what a virus was. Took till decades later and electron microscopes being invented. Can’t imagine what that was like….
PS, I’m in favor of vaccination too (got my second shot Apr 13).
@Mary Lynne Well I learned in school that viruses mutate to more transmissible but less lethal forms. I personally think that virus mutation is governed by probabilities in that the changes that allow it to replicate are the ones that stick. If it kills the host it no longer can replicate. Any mutation that allows it to spread easier will also aid it’s replication. Considering that viruses aren’t considered to be alive, there must be something mathematical using simple rules combined with replication. Anyway, this is what I have always heard to be true. The main threat for mutations are countries like India where there are a lot of people and overwhelmed medical systems. It didn’t take long for the first Covid to spread all over the world.
The longer people go unvaccinated, the more time Covid has to mutate.
@Polar Opposite, people alive during the Spanish Flu gained immunity. The flu mutated to a less dangerous form. People today do not have immunity to the Spanish flu of 1918. The Spanish flu is extinct except for a lab in Georgia where it is carefully guarded. If the original Spanish Flu was released today, the results would be horrendous.
What happens if the US falls short of herd immunity? Ask India.
@Leonardo Montalvo it’s crazy how it’s so obvious to some of us. Yet some people are still bamboozled over a year later.
@Leonardo Montalvo It’s not that hard to have that explained to you, but denying it and making out it’s suspicious is just you being a looney tune…
@cat videos Sorry to disappoint you, but most “anti-vaxxers” are not going to die from this disease. Not even close.
@Leonardo Montalvo hey man, only 99.98% of people will survive without the vaccine! no freedom until we eradicate death!
@cat videos
Actually the fatality rate is closer to 1.8%.
33 million infected with nearly 600,000 dead. That’s 1.8%.
For now.
Those who will not get the vaccine will walk in their “Freedom ” infecting those who will not get the vaccine..and those who have..
Except that infecting those already vaccinated is incidental. The unvaccinated people are the biggest hindrance to herd immunity. But like you said, they are free to be defiant.
@Anti Factoid Unless it mutates enough through them. Then their “freedom” becomes everyone’s plague, without exception.
@Anti Factoid And that is the biggest lie that big pharma ever told and it never dies. The unvaccinated are not the problem the vaccinated bioweapons will be the greatest threat to humanity so don’t celebrate and brag about it.
Well, half of republicans saying they won’t get the vaccine.
Poison herd immunity
@may wilson okay, getting a little dictatorish..
@may wilson, you can easily buy fake vaccine cards that look just like the real ones. There are fakes everywhere.
@may wilson, they got fake vaccine cards. People are using them to board flights.
@David Koresh Hello David, please don’t mind annoying people like May Wilson. We are all Americans (unless you’re living abroad), and we ought to treat each other with dignity and respect, regardless of our petty disagreements. I would however recommend getting vaccinated and wearing a mask in public for a number of reasons I have below. Please share with your friends and family if possible as this is one area of our lives where community support is required to make it work.
The risk of death or hospitalization is fairly high for Covid compared to most diseases you’ll likely come into contact with, and the long-term effects of infection and lung damage are still unknown. The hospitalization rate overall is 2-5% of infected people, and it is higher if you are on the older side.
The FDA runs phase 1, 2, and 3 trials where they test all of the attempts (I think 7-15 vaccines started out as they narrowed down the process) at creating a vaccine that is effective enough to stimulate an immune response that is strong enough to combat the virus when you come into contact with it when you’re out and about. In addition, those trials take place in multiple stages with more cumulatively more people being tested to ensure that they get a “representative” sample. Representative means that the reactions and immune responses of the sample mirror that of the much larger population. So by the time phase 3 trials start, the FDA is testing the vaccine against a control group with 20,000 people in each category. While it doesn’t seem like a large number, 20,000 in each group for the studies has been shown statistically to get very very close to mirroring the whole population, so while things like the 1 in 500,000 blood clots with the J&J vaccine do happen, the risk of vaccine injury relative to the risk of unvaccinated exposure favors getting vaccinated. Think about the benefits of being able to drive around in your car, and how those benefits usually outweigh the risk of getting into a car accident. All of the vaccines approved in the United States have shown statistically significant reductions during FDA trials in hospitalizations and deaths when exposed to covid, reductions in contracting the virus, and additionally (and very importantly), no statistically significant increases in other dangerous health conditions. As the rollout happens, some vaccine injuries do occur such as the J&J blood clots, but the trials rule out all but the most incredibly unlikely vaccine injuries.
Some drugs and vaccines wash out and fail in phases 1 and 2 because they aren’t effective, some even fail in phase 3. During Phase 1 studies, researchers generally test a new drug candidate in healthy volunteers. In most cases, 20 to 80 healthy volunteers participate in Phase 1. The primary purpose of a Phase 1 study is to evaluate the safety of a new drug candidate before it proceeds to further clinical studies. As studies proceed, the shift in interest changes from safety (as safety has generally been proven early in the study series) towards the effectiveness of treatment.
The 2 main reasons why herd immunity is a public health objective, instead of recommending everyone to individually decide if they’d like the extra protection or not is (1) that some people who would like to get extra protection cannot get it because they are “immune-compromised” and (2) the choice not to get vaccinated allows the virus to spread to other people more easily (through higher caseloads) when there are shortages of vaccine, like right now. The variants mutating so quickly is another reason why high caseloads are dangerous, as unvaccinated people may unwittingly act as Petri dishes for more dangerous Covid mutations to take hold that the current versions of the vaccine may not be resistant against. The negative impacts on other people make it so that not getting vaccinated has some really serious potential to harm other people, even if it is inadvertent and not intended.
How about fining antivaxxers for endangering public safety?
@Michele Conner I support your right to abortion if you support my right not to get your precious poison vaccine. Deal?
I say just refuse treatment for them if they do get COVID and become very sick. They didn’t want the vaccine, ignored masking and social distancing, Why should they have it both ways? They ignored medical advice and refused something that would have prevented it, or kept them from getting severely ill, all in the name of “freedom”? Then they come down with it and expect intensive care beds? WTH?
@Jeff F Im ok with this as long as we also stop treating obese people, drug addicts, smokers, and alcoholics.
Everyone already has fake vaccine cards. There’s no way for anyone to tell who has it and who doesn’t.
@bryanatwku That is why Gates wants to track everyone. He has to protect his investment.
What happens if we fall short?
The domestic terrorists win.
republicans die
I don’t get it.
More like Russia and China, who are behind this dis-information anti-vaxer information online. People don’t realize where the information they read online is coming from, and how badely these countries want to destroy our democracy so they can continue justifying their dictatorships and surpass the US as the global leader.
Antivaxxers: say no to Trumpoison
Can we get vaccinated so that we no longer need masks in stores/most jobs? I mean don’t get me wrong I was worried myself, but I’d rather get the shot than be on a ventilator. Also, having asthmatic family members was a big driver to get vaccinated.
The person immunized likely won’t get Covid. Masks are still needed to protect others. At least 70% need to be vaccinated before things can return to normal. Blame those not getting vaccinated. I think many are just afraid of needles.
Why don’t you ask the doctors and scientists that are speaking out on the dangers of the experimental shot? Ask them questions not random CCP trolls.
@Golden Shine, my body, my choice.
We may not reach herd immunity, but we may possibly thin the herd of Right Wing crazies when they catch Covid and pass on,.
It’s far more likely that those vaccinated for just the original strain will succumb to variants as a result of immune interference. The variants will adapt to the vaccine induced immune response and when it does there will be no way for the vaccinated immune system to alter that original antigenic sin. Hence, the immune interference. It’ll be worse than having done nothing at all and by the time they tell everybody that it’ll be far too late. They really should have studied it longer.
Well that’s too bad, covid has a 99.7 survival rate
Covid has a survival rate similar to the average night in Chicago.
So I work in an industry that tends to be more conservative minded (trucking) and it is so frustrating to hear people say they are not going to get vaccinated. You can talk facts and science all day but they are not going to change their minds.
Not surprised about Truckers but scary as they travel through every state.
People like that should be refused medical care if they end up getting COVID and become very sick.
@Wisconsin ManOut of 2 million doses: 8 people reacted. 2 died. Covid-19 has already killed almost 600k Americans. Do the math. What are YOU afraid of? Guaranteed your parents protected You by getting your vaxxers for school. Do you care about anyone else getting sick or dying because of YOU? If not, don’t call yourself an American because your country means nothing to you! I pray for all the innocents you come into contact with as you have decided to be a superspreader. People use products they have no clue about EVERYDAY so how is this an issue? SMH. Anti-vax/max = Domestic Terrorists in my book. You threaten our health, economy, world reputation and our way of life. Adapt or die.
@Jeff F Easy Adolf. You people are pathetic.
@Michelle M And the media has done their job on people like you.. SCARY.. Really? Dear God.
I wonder when health insurance companies will start denying coverage to people who decline to get vaccinated?
The government is no longer forcing insurance companies to cover the costs of covid hospitalizations as of May 1st. If you go to the hospital with covid, you WILL end up being bankrupt, and rightfully so. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. If you don’t believe in science, please go live with the Amish and stop using all of the inventions we have because science actually works at providing good solutions to our problems.
@Rocket Boards you’re truly a sad human being. I hope your soul finds happiness.
@Rocket Boards Quit wanting the scientific method to be used lol 👌 There has to be informed consent to join a trial ya know like the Nuremberg Code states and for good reason.
That would be appropriate. Supposedly soon it won’t be emergency use.
@Golden Shine FDA won’t approve it. It is killing people soooo…
It’s only gonna hurt the antivaxxers by getting them sick.
Vaccinated people will get ill too, and those who are unable to be vaccinated… So much collateral damage.
@qantj vulpis it’s already proven that if a vaccinated person gets sick from COVID it is very minimal.
@Freedom Yes, but going ahead, If it continues to spread and mutate further through people who refuse vaccination (and there are more than enough of them), it will eventually render the current vaccines ineffective. Their “rights” = everybody’s loss.
@Jeff F well not ineffective. As many Doctors have said, this could very well become like the flu shot. Everyone vaccinated will get a booster or updated shot each year to keep safe and to keep from spreading it more.
Who enjoys NOT having polio? How about small pox? ✋
I know, right? Even seasonal flu!
yet, we have many senior citizens who experienced the horrors of Polio and Small Pox.. who refuse to get vaccinated .. people over 80 years old who are worried about the long term side effects of the COVID Vaccine, LOL… people past the avg life expectancy, LOL.
I don’t doubt any number of them think they still have some residual microchips inherited from their grandparents’ polio vaccinations – that happened years before chips even existed.
A portion of the population will remain in self quarantine, forget movies, restaurant or anywhere closed in.
Thanks, Rachel! Thanks, Apoorva! 💜
A threat is that, in the absence of herd immunity, the virus will have opportunities to mutate. It’s a crap shoot whether new variants will be worse or not as bad.
It might fall short because there is so many who won’t want to take it