CNN's Fareed Zakaria discusses the role secularization is playing in the polarization of the United States as the fight over abortion intensifies.
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See Fareed Zakaria’s warning for the US as abortion fight rages
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Fareed didn’t dig deeply enough. He neglected (1) the role of Rupert Murdoch’s Fox News in promoting a divisive culture war to boost ratings, (2) the effect of primitive voting methods that count at most one of the majorities instead of counting all of the head-to-head majorities, and (3) the reform decades ago that changed the two parties’ candidate nomination process from a “smoke-filled room” of party bosses (who cared mainly about winning and weren’t very ideological about social issues) to primary elections (where ideologically polarized voters have the strongest incentive to vote).
@Mark How about you show me in the constitution where abortion is even mentioned at all?
@Gerald Lol, thanks for destroying your own argument with that last comment
Happy Mother’s Day, I mean “Birthing Person’s Day,” to all the mom’s, I mean “birthing person’s,” out there.
Fareed is correct to an extent but I would argue that the decline of Christianity has led many to seek out identity, tribes and purpose in political ideologies and culture war fights instead. Let’s remember that Donald Trump and the MAGA movement aren’t exactly the best examples of Christian piety.
Edit: Plus Ireland has had a massive influx of secularism and modernity in a much more rapid time but didn’t get hit by the culture war as hard. On top of that the “woke left” by in large is also white and many working class blacks and Hispanics are turned off by some of it’s ideas.
@E K define “woke”
@Kristi Progressive, marxist, materialistic. They are envious and angry. They are interested in second things, not first things(C.S. Lewis). A great book from 1950 by Eric Hoffer(The True Believer) described this movement seventy years before the word was invented.
truthhttps://youtu.be/A3Xk9-Znf40
You are wrong. the Maga movement is totally representative of American conservative Christianity.
“Why is America exceptionally polarized?” The American system is severely lacking educating its citizens in basic science, math, civics and critical thinking skills.
That is sure true. Educational deficiency. RS.
As someone who grew up in a fundamentalists religion I understand how these people think. They truly believe they are right so it very difficult to reason with them. They’re absolutists with all the answers and there not much room for compromise. So good luck you are going to need it
@Jock Young If you’re talking about the biological definition of human sex, it’s based on the expression of the SRY gene, which would affect your body’s organization towards producing either ova or sperm. If you’re talking about gender as a concept separate from biological sex, then biology does not cover such a topic – that would be up to society as a whole to reach a consensus.
@Gandalf Stormcrow Sigh…
Yes, we all get BLM mansions.
Shiny object…. Squirrel!
@mathman43 15 Logical Fallacies You Should Know Before Getting Into a Debate
Logical fallacies are flawed, deceptive, or false arguments that can be proven wrong with reasoning. These are the most common fallacies you should know about.
Arguments and debates are an important part of college and academic discourse. But not every argument is perfect. Some can be picked apart because they have errors in reasoning and rhetoric. These are called “logical fallacies,” and they’re very common.
You’ll hear logical fallacies in the classroom, during televised debates, and in arguments with your friends. It can even be challenging to avoid using them yourself.
15 Types of Logical Fallacies
TABLE OF CONTENTS
Ad Hominem
Strawman Argument
Appeal to Ignorance
False Dilemma
Slippery Slope Fallacy
Circular Argument
Hasty Generalization
Red Herring Fallacy
Appeal to Hypocrisy
Causal Fallacy
Fallacy of Sunk Costs
Appeal to Authority
Equivocation
Appeal to Pity
Bandwagon Fallacy
—
Ad Hominem
An ad hominem fallacy uses personal attacks rather than logic. This fallacy occurs when someone rejects or criticizes another point of view based on the personal characteristics, ethnic background, physical appearance, or other non-relevant traits of the person who holds it.
Ad hominem arguments are often used in politics, where they are often called “mudslinging.” They are considered unethical because politicians can use them to manipulate voters’ opinions against an opponent without addressing core issues. The ad-hominem logical fallacy AKA: (Attacking the person): This fallacy occurs when, instead of addressing someone’s argument or position, you irrelevantly attack the person or some aspect of the person who is making the argument. The fallacious attack can also be direct to membership in a group or institution.
A red herring is something that misleads or distracts from a relevant or important question. It may be either a logical fallacy or a literary device that leads readers or audiences toward a false conclusion.
3:24 – Let’s never forget, we in the US have a secular Constitution. The biggest difference between religious Americans in the left and religious Americans in the right is that far more religious Americans in the right want to make the government a Christian theocracy.
Additionally, we need to evolve past the idea that the right is more religious just because they say they are in polling. Many of those who claim to be religious on the right are posturing, frankly.
The main reason for this is that the Republican party is openly Christian dominated, and often shows open hostility to other religious faiths or atheism. It is a “go along to get along” answer from GOP voters in some measure.
Similarly, there are more Democrats who say they support an end to de-facto segregation in our communities than are willing to actually vote for it when it becomes a referendum on occasion.
religious faiths or atheism? Where are the Coat hanger Emoji’s?
Like all those Southern Baptists that condemn drinking, gambling, and dancing but will do it all when they think they won’t be found out. They will tell you they went to Branson MO when actually they went to Las Vegas NV.
The answer lies in the charts. Why the hell is the American Right so far on the right on the chart on so many things including importance of Christianity vs other Western countries? This is not about left vs right anymore, it’s more about progress vs medieval mentality.
@hangender We don’t love it at all hangender…paradise is not the issue, it’s a real life scenario that we all face regardless of political persuasion. Life is not as simple as you want to make it. Think hangender, think!
@Jay Umble we all face it? Yet there are no tent cities in midwest.
Think jay, think!
@hangender Thanks man!! Love it.
@hangender
Try living in a tent city when a good portion of the year the weather is too cold, snowy and harsh to be outdoors for a hour, let alone trying to survive in a tent! You simplistic example of using the Midwest as a barometer of less poverty and better moral values doesn’t work here, because the climate in the Midwest is simply not a conducive environment for tent city dwellers! There’s enough poverty and need in the Midwest too, but we simply don’t see our homeless like warm states do, because again, it’s too damned cold! I live in Wisconsin, I had a great job, but became too ill to work (no fault of my own), so I became homeless for a time, so yes I know what I’m talking about! Geez!
@Kryptonarie 63 Florida is cold all the time and therefore it have no tent cities?
And Boston, since it have tent cities, must be warmer than Florida?
Really now. That’s some geography you got there.
The U.S. has seen the church moving from being a value-based institution that promotes compassion and understanding, to a more tribal, culture-police force. The Church has gone from being fairly apolitical to highly political. It’s also moved from being an instrument for a a great community good (now seen as socialism) to a force for individual responsibility and accountability, and sometimes just selfishness. Where once the poor, were a group that the church reached out to, wanted to help and support, now the church is more likely to promote the narrative that poor people are poor because of some moral failing, and it’s their own fault. For an example look no further than Billy Graham who was famously non-political and counseled presidents of both parties, to his son, who is highly-and out-spokenly political. Churches are more and more political, and even in cultural issues like mask-mandates seem very comfortable embracing far-right conspiracy theories. Meanwhile the religious left who sees the churches role as championing the underdog, the oppressed, and the downtrodden seems to have all but disappeared. I think the younger generations has returned more to being compassionate and valuing diversity and communities, but seemingly outside of any sort of organized church or institution.
What do you mean when you say “The Church”? My church doesn’t involve itself in politics. You should be more specific instead of painting everyone with a broad brush.
It’s probably a mix of things however as a teacher I think there is something to be looked at within the vast difference between public and private education.
@Deborah Freedman So what is your solution?
@Kevin Preston public education as a whole is garbage in this country. Even in the 90s when I was in college, the kids from the elite private schools were light years ahead of me in the non math/science areas. Light years.
@Will Sani I was asking Jenny what was her solution to the problem when she came out against private education
truthhttps://youtu.be/A3Xk9-Znf40
Very interesting analysis. Thank you.
America is so well off … we can fight over things that are none of our business like other peoples life choices ….
@Sean McCartney I know there’s never an emoji when you need one …
@gary waidelich evolution favors species that cooperate …
@Stephen Rickstrew I was just pointing out your flawed theology about people staying out of your business. By your last comment I take it that you aren’t evolved then.
truthhttps://youtu.be/A3Xk9-Znf40
@JackOllie4 You forgot highest maternal mortality and infant mortalit rate in the developed world. Double that of EU countries.
No limits on campaign contributions and right wing evangelical extremists are hugely to blame.
Weird focus on gap comparison. The charts clearly show the US Left right in line, if not just to the right of, Europe. It’s the US far right that has veered far, far to the right
One thing to remember about abortion – before Roe v. Wade the religious community was largely agnostic about terminating a pregnancy. Many prominent evangelicals at the time had little say about it, characterizing it correctly as a woman’s choice. Then the federal government, responding to the plethora of private schools in the south that sprang up as a result of Brown v. Board of Education, said that taxing them was on the table. The religious right needed an issue to galvanize their voters. Using race wasn’t advisable anymore, so they seized upon abortion as an issue to unite the right. It was every effective, and drove evangelical Christians to the polls.
Keep that in mind the next time some religious zealot tries to convince you that they’re just defending “life”. And remind them also that the Republican party (invariably their party) has cut the federal safety net in every budget since Nixon. Republican concern for children ends at the birth canal.
@Kyle Ayres Leave your feelings and opinions out of other peoples lives
@Tom Tedford The point of government is to regulate the lives of people, so we don’t live under anarchy.
@Kyle Ayres If you don’t believe in it, then don’t do it. Leave others be. Your beliefs are your’s alone. You have no right to impose them on others.
@Sean McCartney I picture you as some creepy old guy in a dirty sleeveless Tshirt, missing teeth and a 3rd grade education.
Division makes oceans of grievance money for special interests (regardless of ideology), whether its ‘Affirmative’ Action or Trump, and gives reason to take power, overall. That’s partly why. Fear and marked suspicion of each other, and the milking of it via tools like social media and bots. I have a strong feeling, though, that most of us are inherently fair and must divorce from social negativity if we are to survive. We are more fair than we are allowed most of the time to know because fear and loathing make for great ratings.
A society that is trying to function “normally” in the 21st century while increasingly believing in conspiracy theories and religion, itself a theory, is always going to struggle to make sense of anything important.
Where are the wire Coat Hanger Emoji’s?
The answer to Mr Zakaria’s question (can the two cultural camps in the USA co-exist peacefully together?) is a ‘NO’, and the reason for this is that one side of this divide demand the right to impose their diktat on everyone; – on their neighbours and their communities and on the rest of the country. Having different laws in various states may work to a limited extent, but when those laws reflect very different, incompatible, and fundamental principles, and when people demand that their own fundamentals have to apply to everyone, then peaceful co-existence becomes impossible.
Here in the UK we also have this problem, most notably with sections of our Muslim population, but this community numbers less than ten percent of our population and it is still not too late for us to avert the kind of disastrous cultural clash that you Yanks are already suffering (although our cowardly and short-sighted governments of both major political parties are as yet unwilling to grasp this nettle to avoid future civil strife). In the USA you have tens of millions of people who are not just intolerant of those with different beliefs and values (and skin colours,… race is an important and ever-present factor is your culture wars) but who are constantly issuing threats and endorsing violence and intimidation in order to create a climate of fear and insecurity. Your country has long been in a state of low-level civil-war and I see little chance of this being resolved without major trauma.
Got a friend from Ghana. Muslims and Christians coexist peacefully. U.S. is so polarized. The entitlement leads to me me me. Selfish mindset
truthhttps://youtu.be/dpoFCCQYllw
Interesting perspective. Fairly accurate assessment.
In successful democracies, leaders secure votes by bringing people together. In USA, politicians try to stay in power by dividing the people. Capitalists profit by dividing the people.
Where are you from?
@Alpha Delta My point is it is only one side that is doing the dividing. To answer your question, here in Canada, we don’t have this extreme polarization, and that’s because we don’t have a major political party that has merged with white Christian Nationalism.
The religious right in America bears considerable responsibility for being reactionary to secularization. Evangelicalism in particular has taken a clear fundamentalist turn (with the support of wealthy elites). At the same time, the Far Right has adopted a communitarian view of freedom. Liberals by default are tolerant by individual differences, but as Conservatives became more radical they have insisted that freedom must be what their own moral community chooses, while paradoxically, it must apply to others. And, America is unique in one other way – it lacks a cohesive popular left. Many that are drawn to the far right through legitimate discontent with the status quo have no institutional means to channel these grievances through dedicated social communitarian impulses such as labour, green or feminist politics and parties.